Twitter under Musk....

AuroraSaab

Senior Member
The growth of TikTok is more recent so older kids probably missed out on the worst of it. As DutchGuy says it's their algorithms. Watch a couple of pro anorexia TikToks - they'll send you 20 more. Follow one self harming kid who posts videos of stuff, they'll recommend others. It's a rabbit hole that sucks in vulnerable kids and overwhelms them with stuff that feeds on their insecurities.

I don't know about TikTok but Twitter are very slow to remove offensive content and the moderation definitely has an agenda to it that very much reflects a US liberal/left wing bent.
 

stowie

Active Member
You might not be to interested because it's not your political direction but there are several interviews that show twitter, facebook and most of the big social media make choices political choices in majority in favor of the left.
So are you concerned about a rich men buying twitter or are you concerned their direction could become more balanced? or more pro-republican/rights?
The merger announcement alone has shown lots of the ones always screaming about inclusivity, acceptance and tolerance turning out to be inclusive, tolerant and accepting if it fits their agenda.

Really? I thought that the algorithms amplified your current bias. For example, my twitter is largely centrist left-leaning, very remain and - dare I say it - a bit London metropolitan. I assume that is because the people I follow and tweets I may like etc. are along these lines. I assume that if I started a new account following brexiteers and right-wing social conservatives with interests in the countryside, my recommendations and feed would reflect that instead.

Certainly, I think there are more high profile right wingers who have been kicked off twitter. But when you look at these cases then they transgress from political opinion to "speech" that could be deemed unlawful in some way. I mean, Trump fomented insurrection before Twitter kicked him!

That is not neccasarly true, yes there are video's like that on tiktok instagram etc. but before tiktok and instagram we had fashion magazines, a bit later normal internet pages etc. The accusations of then and now are not that much different just the medium where it is on, and modern sites use a lot of tracking so keep on sprouting the same type of content, so that puts more pressure on parents actually knowing their child and talking about the dangers their self imagine etc.

In a way. But pre-internet we had media content that had - to some level - been curated. Imagery that you can find without too much effort would never have been allowed through standard print media or TV. Plus the sheer scale of content and the precision targeting of the algorithms is different. It can fill your whole personal world. Plus, the other aspect is the continuous on-line connectivity. If children were bullied or having a bad time at school then home was a safe place away from that for a while. Now it can follow you everywhere.

Being the father of a teenage daughter, I feel in the middle of this storm, and pretty poorly equipped to understand it - my teenage years were pre-internet and even being from a technical background doesn't help - the app content frequently mystifies me. What I do know is that "guidance" from social media tells me to "be involved" with my child's online activity. Well OK. But their entire system structure is geared the other way because - I suspect - they know that the best way to keep young people swiping is precisely the opposite to enabling content control. I cast my mind back to my teenage years, and I think my parents didn't really know half the sh!t I got up to, or worries I had. Knowing your child during the teenage years is incredibly tough especially since often the last people teens want to talk to about this stuff is their parents.

I hope children growing up with the internet learn how to manage this stream of information that is curated not necessarily with your best interests in mind. Because us adults really haven't.....
 

albion

Well-Known Member
The world is full of algorithms. The worlds most successful companies depend on them., otherwise chaos and decline seep in.
Musk himself depends even more but unfortunately for him, his gets far too complex.
I do not think he ever intends/intended to buy twitter but if I am wrong, it might be to entwine the 'futuristic world of Tesla' into it.
 

dutchguylivingintheuk

Well-Known Member
Really? I thought that the algorithms amplified your current bias. For example, my twitter is largely centrist left-leaning, very remain and - dare I say it - a bit London metropolitan. I assume that is because the people I follow and tweets I may like etc. are along these lines. I assume that if I started a new account following brexiteers and right-wing social conservatives with interests in the countryside, my recommendations and feed would reflect that instead.
I wasn't talking about the algorithms is more about when they(the poeple working at twitter) decide whenever they have too make an decision on whether something is allowed or not. partly due to their own bias leftish things are far more often allowed, then rightish things are allowed


Certainly, I think there are more high profile right wingers who have been kicked off twitter. But when you look at these cases then they transgress from political opinion to "speech" that could be deemed unlawful in some way. I mean, Trump fomented insurrection before Twitter kicked him!
Agree with you they those where rightly so banned, however they extreme left says much worse things, actions and so on and does not get banned, that is the issue. There are more than enough concentration on right winger but not enough on the far left. How many press coverage was their for the far left burning the democrats office right after Biden won for example? And how much would there have been of some far right off-shoot did it?

Same for over here in europe 9 out of 10 right wing demonstrations gets interrupted by violent mobs calling themselves antiafa, anti-fascist etc. whatever they change their name so quickly and letting these persons run wild only enables a wrong message ''f*cking with democracy is fine as long as your on the ''right'' side'' and yes i'm very aware that most right wing protestors are very much opposed to democracy. But democracy should function regardless of the message.

In a way. But pre-internet we had media content that had - to some level - been curated. Imagery that you can find without too much effort would never have been allowed through standard print media or TV. Plus the sheer scale of content and the precision targeting of the algorithms is different. It can fill your whole personal world. Plus, the other aspect is the continuous on-line connectivity. If children were bullied or having a bad time at school then home was a safe place away from that for a while. Now it can follow you everywhere.
That's why all those models now come out to say they where being forced to not eat back in the day to confirm to a certain body inmagine, that why we now have brands that make clothing, fashion ect for all kinds or body types, your not entirely wrong, i'm just pointing out that there are two sides to this picture and that there is also an movement to empower more natural body shapes. to give an example, the potential of internet is just so massive, that my main point is that what seems to be happening is the oppostie van what supposed to be happening, so parent seem to let their children go unsupervised on the internet unaware of what they are doing and if it goes wrong they blame social media, lack of controls etc. or their credit card company if they where silly enough to left their credit card attached to their childs account.


Children being bullied is from all times, it is horrible but to think that in the past their was a safe space because bullying goes much deeper, once their in your mind their is no escaping but i agree with you that cyberbullying is a new part of the ''game'' i never experienced the safe space, despite their not being internet at the time.

Being the father of a teenage daughter, I feel in the middle of this storm, and pretty poorly equipped to understand it - my teenage years were pre-internet and even being from a technical background doesn't help - the app content frequently mystifies me. What I do know is that "guidance" from social media tells me to "be involved" with my child's online activity.
Being ''involved'' and understanding what it is their doing or what they find interesting about it are two different things. Think it's more about seeing behavaior changes and talking about it if neccasary than exactly knowing how an certain app/internet language etc. works.

Well OK. But their entire system structure is geared the other way because - I suspect - they know that the best way to keep young people swiping is precisely the opposite to enabling content control. I cast my mind back to my teenage years, and I think my parents didn't really know half the sh!t I got up to, or worries I had. Knowing your child during the teenage years is incredibly tough especially since often the last people teens want to talk to about this stuff is their parents.

I hope children growing up with the internet learn how to manage this stream of information that is curated not necessarily with your best interests in mind. Because us adults really haven't.....
Well it's actually the easyiest to go back to when gmail was introduced, you got free at the time claimed ''unlimited email'' but you had to deal with ads that scan through your messages to offer relevant offer, put that on steroids with not only ads but also content you see, things you write hell maybe even content based on your heartrate in the futute is the basis of all these algorithms that make social media.

Some things are positive others negative, but there is no opting out anymore.
 

Ian H

Über Member
Just in case anybody needs to catch up with recent goings on over at twitter, this is the thread you need.

musk.JPG
...and sacking them.
 

albion

Well-Known Member
A bigger descent in chos than I initially thought.
https://nypost.com/2022/11/15/fired...ts-elon-musk-company-as-bunch-of-cowards/amp/

One does wonder what talent at twitter remains.
 

AuroraSaab

Senior Member
The starting salary for graduates at Twitter, Google, Facebook etc. seems to be around $120k plus, plus perks. Doesn't seem unreasonable that there are high expectations.

In other news, Twitter has now made it easy to report child abuse content and other porn. After years of being asked.

Fhf02nnWQAAxGrs.jpeg
 
The starting salary for graduates at Twitter, Google, Facebook etc. seems to be around $120k plus, plus perks. Doesn't seem unreasonable that there are high expectations.

In other news, Twitter has now made it easy to report child abuse content and other porn. After years of being asked.

View attachment 2508

Is there anyone left at Twitter to assess, and if necessary act upon, the reports?
 

AuroraSaab

Senior Member
Only 15% of the moderators who cover hateful and abusive content have been sacked apparently. Though the guy who said that has since been sacked himself.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.abc.net.au/article/101650146

Hopefully now child abuse content and porn are able to be reported as specific things they will be prioritised for removal. Previously child abuse came under the same vague reporting action as reporting someone for calling you fat. Twitter chose not to deal with the problem.

If Twitter had put as much effort into clearing out porn and child abuse as they did into 'curating' the news narrative then perhaps people would have more sympathy for those getting laid off.
 

Wobblers

New Member
The starting salary for graduates at Twitter, Google, Facebook etc. seems to be around $120k plus, plus perks. Doesn't seem unreasonable that there are high expectations.

In other news, Twitter has now made it easy to report child abuse content and other porn. After years of being asked.

View attachment 2508

While 120k / year may sound a lot, the reality is that these tech companies are based in some of the most expensive places to live in the world. The cheapest rents in even the seediest parts of Silicon Valley top 4k per month, for instance. That generous pay packet is very rapidly eroded by living costs.

I also note that Twitter were paying that before Musk started demanding 80 hour weeks from his employees. He is in fact demanding a very large pay cut. Consider that 80 work hours constitutes close to 75% of most peoples' waking hours - and that isn't factoring in commute times, which for most is likely to be long. How long do you think most will be able to stand this pace before damaging their mental and/or physical health... or worse? 120k to destroy your health hardily seems like an equitable deal to me.

Finally, how good a job do you think a moderator working those sort of hours will be able to do? Twitter already couldn't cope with its moderation requirements - in that context a 15% cut in moderator numbers is unlikely to improve matters.
 
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