Prince Andrew

I don't doubt that, but, it will not "save" the reputation of the Royal Family (IMHO), since he is, inextricably, part of it (the Royal Family).

To be clear, I am not a Royalist, no problem with the Country becoming a Republic, provided we do not simply replace one set of privileged elite with another set of the same.

Well those set of replacements are already there they called torries, labour etc. with a few exceptions none of them are sitting there for the poeple, but mainly for themselves, as is the same in many other countries unfortunately
 

Mr Celine

New Member
According to the Grauniad he retains his military rank of vice admiral.
Seems rather apt.
 

matticus

Active Member
According to the Grauniad he retains his military rank of vice admiral.
Seems rather apt.
I admit I googled that to check - it's almost too good to be true :laugh:

I wonder why he's keeping that one - because he did actually serve in the Navy? Dunno; who is forum Royal Correspondent??
 

Beebo

Regular
I admit I googled that to check - it's almost too good to be true :laugh:

I wonder why he's keeping that one - because he did actually serve in the Navy? Dunno; who is forum Royal Correspondent??
Yes. This was a rank he actually obtained.
Like a retired Major, you retain your rank for life.
 

swansonj

Regular
Yes. This was a rank he actually obtained.
Like a retired Major, you retain your rank for life.
Not precisely, I think.

He retired from active service with the rank of Commander and if he were not royal, would still be styled Commander. Since then, he has been promoted twice to become Vice Admiral, in accordance with the tradition that members of the Royal Famy who have had military careers but then stopped are promoted broadly in line with the career progression of those of their cohort who continued in active service.
 

swansonj

Regular
Not precisely, I think.

He retired from active service with the rank of Commander and if he were not royal, would still be styled Commander. Since then, he has been promoted twice to become Vice Admiral, in accordance with the tradition that members of the Royal Famy who have had military careers but then stopped are promoted broadly in line with the career progression of those of their cohort who continued in active service.
ETA: I assume that what he is giving up is all his appointments, albeit in some cases associated with honorary ranks - colonel in chief of this and that regiment etc. Because they are appointments they can be given up. I'm not sure whether you can give up a rank can you? though you could clearly decide just not to use the rank in every day life - many retired officers see no need to style themselves as "Major X" etc.
 

swansonj

Regular
Can we unpack this "paedophile prince" business? I understand paedophilia to be an attraction to prepubescent people. I don't think there's any suggestion that the ladies Andrew has been involved in the trafficking of, the coercion of, the abuse of, the manipulation of, and possibly the rape of, are prepubescent? On the contrary, I rather assumed that the tastes of that circle ran to rather obviously pubescent ladies.

I think the gravity of Andrew's offences lies in the coercion, the abuse of highly asymmetrical power relationships, the abuse of his own power to exploit women in women in vastly more vulnerable positions.

I also think that it suits quite a lot of people to cast him as a paedophile because it distracts attention from just how widespread the tendencies he has indulged are in our society. It's not so long ago that it was pretty much completely acceptable for a healthy red-blooded male (sic) to lust after a sexy schoolgirl (sic). Page 3 openly indulged that tendency. In certain sections of business, not to mention the police, no Christmas party was complete without waitresses dressed as schoolgirls. And look at the whole MeToo thing.

I'd suggest that there are quite a few tabloid journalists, MPs, and others in powerful positions who are only too happy to play up the paedophilia aspect of the reporting of Andrew because it distracts attention from the overlap of their own approaches to life and his...
 

mjr

Regular
I think it's just the alliteration that has made it catch on. Maybe Rapist Royal will be seen as more appropriate once the court case finishes.
That, and many in the USA seem to use "paedophile" whenever the victim was under their legal age of consent.
 

swansonj

Regular
Spitting Image already had him nailed in the 1980's - "Randy Andy, just a prince who just can't say no"
Doesn't "Randy Andy" rather sanitise his behaviour, implying that he's just got a slightly too healthy libido, but no.more than you'd expect from any other dashing wartime helicopter pilot? As for "couldn't say no", doesn't that rather imply all these ladies were throwing themselves at him and the poor lad can't really be expected to say no? It strikes me as very much of its time, pre MeToo and pre a lot of other things, and not appropriate for a case of trafficking of under age girls against their will to be coerced into sex with vastly more powerful men.
 

matticus

Active Member
Spitting Image already had him nailed in the 1980's - "Randy Andy, just a prince who just can't say no"

Doesn't "Randy Andy" rather sanitise his behaviour, implying that he's just got a slightly too healthy libido, but no.more than you'd expect from any other dashing wartime helicopter pilot? As for "couldn't say no", doesn't that rather imply all these ladies were throwing themselves at him and the poor lad can't really be expected to say no? It strikes me as very much of its time, pre MeToo and pre a lot of other things, and not appropriate for a case of trafficking of under age girls against their will to be coerced into sex with vastly more powerful men.
Spitting Image was on before the trafficking of under-age girls was in the media (and I think it was before Randy Andy got involved).
 
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