Prince Andrew

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mudsticks

Squire
Can we unpack this "paedophile prince" business? I understand paedophilia to be an attraction to prepubescent people. I don't think there's any suggestion that the ladies Andrew has been involved in the trafficking of, the coercion of, the abuse of, the manipulation of, and possibly the rape of, are prepubescent? On the contrary, I rather assumed that the tastes of that circle ran to rather obviously pubescent ladies.

I think the gravity of Andrew's offences lies in the coercion, the abuse of highly asymmetrical power relationships, the abuse of his own power to exploit women in women in vastly more vulnerable positions.

I also think that it suits quite a lot of people to cast him as a paedophile because it distracts attention from just how widespread the tendencies he has indulged are in our society. It's not so long ago that it was pretty much completely acceptable for a healthy red-blooded male (sic) to lust after a sexy schoolgirl (sic). Page 3 openly indulged that tendency. In certain sections of business, not to mention the police, no Christmas party was complete without waitresses dressed as schoolgirls. And look at the whole MeToo thing.

I'd suggest that there are quite a few tabloid journalists, MPs, and others in powerful positions who are only too happy to play up the paedophilia aspect of the reporting of Andrew because it distracts attention from the overlap of their own approaches to life and his...

Exactly, in many ways I think Andrew in himself is a convenient 'other' to portray as one of the priveleged 'wrong uns' - apart from society, not one of us.

Whereas that power imbalance has been exploited and abused, by all sorts throughout society, throughout history.

It was never ok, its only just of late that a few more victims have even slightly been listened to, rather than told to go away, put up and shut up.

It's not like #metoo has fixed everything, not by a long shot.
 

fozy tornip

fozympotent
So if Anne shuffles off in a riding accident and Charles - his equerry being indisposed - manages to drown himself in toothpaste, then King Andrew?
 

glasgowcyclist

Über Member
With Ms Giuffre already having requested that Prince Andrew be tried by a jury, is he now trying to steal her thunder by calling for the very same thing? https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-60149024

Writing to a US judge, his lawyers state: "Prince Andrew hereby demands a trial by jury on all causes of action asserted in the complaint."
US lawyer Lisa Bloom, who represents a number of Maxwell's and Epstein's accusers, called this demand a "PR move", saying Ms Giuffre had already asked for a jury trial.

I find it hard to believe he'd ever appear in an American court to answer the accusations but then he did agree to do that Emily Maitliss car-crash interview, so who knows?
 

winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
He's not saying that he did anything but, if he did do anything then she can't sue him for the thing that he's not saying that he did do, even if he did do it because... reasons. Many, many reasons.

T to the H to the R to the E to the A to the D


View: https://twitter.com/LisaBloom/status/1486469344137674755?t=VeW_14Jn3UK8V2489qAv4w&s=19
 
Can we unpack this "paedophile prince" business? I understand paedophilia to be an attraction to prepubescent people.
Interesting point paedophillia is feeling attracted to anything below 13 according to the webmd/medical definition.
However if you look at past uk/us court cases than you can only conclude that pedophilia is used for anyone who has sex with someone below the age of consent. Which in this case is extra important since one of ''prince'' Andrew's defenses is ''if i did it, it was with consent'' which is technically impossible considering Virginia was 17 at the time of the events. edited, in the uk the age fo consent is 16, in the US in some states it's 16 in others 18. So depending on where it happened the defense could be technically impossible due to the age of consent.
 
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Rusty Nails

Country Member
Interesting point paedophillia is feeling attracted to anything below 13 according to the webmd/medical definition.
However if you look at past uk/us court cases than you can only conclude that pedophilia is used for anyone who has sex with someone below the age of consent. Which in this case is extra important since one of ''prince'' Andrew's defenses is ''if i did it, it was with consent'' which is technically impossible considering Virginia was 17 at the time of the events. so far i know in both countries below the age of consent which is 18.
You are wrong.
It is 16 in the UK, and in the US there are different ages, depending on the State, between 16 & 18.
 

swansonj

Regular
Interesting point paedophillia is feeling attracted to anything below 13 according to the webmd/medical definition.
However if you look at past uk/us court cases than you can only conclude that pedophilia is used for anyone who has sex with someone below the age of consent. Which in this case is extra important since one of ''prince'' Andrew's defenses is ''if i did it, it was with consent'' which is technically impossible considering Virginia was 17 at the time of the events. edited, in the uk the age fo consent is 16, in the US in some states it's 16 in others 18. So depending on where it happened the defense could be technically impossible due to the age of consent.
My original point was that, although he is now being vilified as a "paedophile", the behaviour of lusting after 17 year old females is still one that is largely supported by considerable sections of society, including many of those doing the vilifying.

IMO, the major issue is not her age (the age difference is an issue for me but that's just my old-fashioned morals speaking) - the issue is coercion and exploitation.
 

winjim

Welcome yourself into the new modern crisis
Wasn't someone on telly using the 'he's not a paedophile, he's an ephebophile' defence in relation to Epstein a while back? Personally I think the term 'paedophile' is overused and frequently unhelpful. It's an appeal to emotion.
 
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