Who Cares...??

[Bromptonaut]

Who sets the Terms of Reference for an enquiry - is this another failing of the Home Secretary?

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/inquiry-launched-into-issues-raised-by-couzens-conviction

 

[pubrunner]

At risk of going off-topic, I'll answer this earlier posting.

Whilst I am enjoying your belated conversion to some sort of pro-feminist position,

I've not had a conversion to any position - I'm neither pro- or anti-feminist - I just believe in treating all people decently.

As I mentioned :

"I don't know what the answer to this might be, other than to ensure that my own son is brought up to treat all women (everyone) with the utmost respect".

Such as (to pluck an example out of the air) mocking and abusing an older woman online, traducing her on other forums as a bitter old witch and posting pictures of Miss Havisham?

The comments that I made, were the only time I've felt the need to direct comments at the poster, rather than to respond to the subject. Those comments were made a good few years ago now and I'm not sure why you feel motivated to raise something that was said in the past (?). For the benefit of anyone who might read this posting, this reply is with reference to something that was posted on a different forum - not this one. (Not forums pl. as you've suggested).

You've neglected to consider why I felt the need to respond in such a manner on that other forum; I'm not sure how you can have been unaware, that I and (very many others on that forum) had been subjected to (many) abusive, patronising and vitriolic comments over many years.

Are you suggesting that as 'older woman', she was somehow entitled to special treatment and should have been allowed to 'get away' with such comments ? After ten years of putting up with comments that were spiteful and directed specifically at me (rather than the topic), I'd just had enough and responded in kind. She dished it out and didn't like it, when someone stood up to her.

If you search that old forum and this new one, you won't be able to find another single example of me responding to anyone else in such a way. If someone makes numerous personal comments against me (and many others), there will (eventually) come a point when they get it back.

I'm flattered that you seem to be monitoring my activities - you will see that on this forum, I have made posted replies that reflect my opinions; I've taken care to try and make them in a way that does not offend others.

Please read my comments on this forum and respond accordingly (or not); you'll see that in all my postings, I've responded politely & respectfully to what other posters have said.

 

[theclaud]

I'm not sure why you feel motivated to raise something that was said in the past (?)

I thought it was obvious - I was struck by the contrast between your professed values in the thread and your actual behaviour towards another member of the CC community. Both this forum and the other one in question are spin-offs of that community, and there's a history - whether you approve of it being mentioned or not.

The observation about age is because you used conventional misogynistic tropes aimed at older women, as I described above. I'm not going to respond to the whiny stuff about how this one deserved it because she was so mean. As I've observed on several occasions over the road, if you want the measure of a man's attitude to women, don't look at how he behaves when women are flattering him, defending him, laughing at his jokes - look at what he does when a woman challenges, contradicts him, or makes mincemeat of his arguments on a forum.

 

[Pale Rider]

I thought it was obvious - I was struck by the contrast between your professed values in the thread and your actual behaviour towards another member of the CC community. Both this forum and the other one in question are spin-offs of that community, and there's a history - whether you approve of it being mentioned or not.

The observation about age is because you used conventional misogynistic tropes aimed at older women, as I described above. I'm not going to respond to the whiny stuff about how this one deserved it because she was so mean. As I've observed on several occasions over the road, if you want the measure of a man's attitude to women, don't look at how he behaves when women are flattering him, defending him, laughing at his jokes - look at what he does when a woman challenges, contradicts him, or makes mincemeat of his arguments on a forum.

The Havisham Incident of 2017 related to a long running dispute between forum members who didn't get on both online and in real life.

It had bugger all to do with the attitude to gender of @pubrunner, or for that matter, the attitude to gender of the now flounced/banned members who played their full part in the nastiness.

Some people just don't get on, nothing else can be reliably drawn from it.

 

[theclaud]

The Havisham Incident of 2017 related to a long running dispute between forum members who didn't get on both online and in real life.

It had bugger all to do with the attitude to gender of @pubrunner, or for that matter, the attitude to gender of the now flounced/banned members who played their full part in the nastiness.

Some people just don't get on, nothing else can be reliably drawn from it.

Thanks for your input, caller.

 

[Pale Rider]

Thanks for your input, caller.

and there's a history - whether you approve of it being mentioned or not.

As long as you understand you don't have a monopoly on the mention of history.

Mind, the thread title - Who cares? - is apposite five years after the event.

 

[theclaud]

As long as you understand you don't have a monopoly on the mention of history.

Mind, the thread title - Who cares? - is apposite five years after the event.

LOL. Well, Paley, the thing people need to grasp about structural issues like racism or misogyny is that structures left in place or reinforced will inevitably produce similar effects. So many people people may or may not remember or care if a couple of uppity women got bullied off and/or banned from a forum a few years back (or if a spin-off forum where people including those you wouldn't trust to be in charge of a hot cup of tea and those whose hard drives should probably be impounded were given moderating powers and the place took about a week to become a cess pit) but the same over-indulged resident reactionaries will react in the same way whenever they are challenged by a woman who stands her ground, answers back, displays expertise or confidence, or doesn't accord them the deference and respect they feel entitled to.

 

[Pale Rider]

LOL. Well, Paley, the thing people need to grasp about structural issues like racism or misogyny is that structures left in place or reinforced will inevitably produce similar effects. So many people people may or may not remember or care if a couple of uppity women got bullied off and/or banned from a forum a few years back (or if a spin-off forum where people including those you wouldn't trust to be in charge of a hot cup of tea and those whose hard drives should probably be impounded were given moderating powers and the place took about a week to become a cess pit) but the same over-indulged resident reactionaries will react in the same way whenever they are challenged by a woman who stands her ground, answers back, displays expertise or confidence, or doesn't accord them the deference and respect they feel entitled to.

As usual, you see misogyny where there is none.

I emphasise to a degree - I can see a criminal court case in most mundane social interactions.

 

[theclaud]

As usual, you see misogyny where there is none.

I emphasise to a degree - I can see a criminal court case in most mundane social interactions.

I don't need your emphasy, Paley. But, amusing malapropisms aside, I'll take my understanding of misogyny over your disingenuous protestations on the subject, any day of the week.

 

[Pale Rider]

I don't need your emphasy, Paley. But, amusing malapropisms aside, I'll take my understanding of misogyny over your disingenuous protestations on the subject, any day of the week.

Ha, ha, perhaps I was emphasising.

I know you will take your misogyny obsessions to the grave, but that just makes them all the sadder.

Anyway, as far as I could gather one of the other main protagonists in The Havisham Incident was a male, so portraying it as women being intimidated lacks accuracy.

 

[pubrunner]

It had bugger all to do with the attitude to gender of @pubrunner, or for that matter, the attitude to gender of the now flounced/banned members who played their full part in the nastiness.

Paley - you are correct in your assertions !

A bit of background information, by way of context.

About ten years ago, I did 3 or 4 CChat rides and theclaud was on everyone of them. We must have got on reasonably well, 'cos she gave me a hug goodbye after each one.

Some time after those rides, I decided to organise a CChat ride from my home. TC's name was one of the first on the list.

When TC arrived at my home, she was given a warm hug and a brew. On the ride itself, she smiled . . . a lot and I've the photos to show this !

When we stopped at a pub, the Hand Hotel in Llanarmon, I bought all my fellow riders a pint . . . including TC.

Essentially, I treated TC exactly the same as I did the rest of the (male) riders.

At the end of the ride, TC went off home with a hug and a large slice of (home-made) coffee cake.

These ^^^ are facts. This ^^^, is how TC was treated by me in 'real life'.

She is now seeking to have me labelled a misogynist, but the 'real-life' facts speak for themselves.

I thought it was obvious - I was struck by the contrast between your professed values in the thread and your actual behaviour towards another member of the CC community.

You've met me on at least half a dozen occasions, including at my own home.

You've seen my 'real-life' 'actual behaviour towards other members of the CC community' - and you know full well, that I've acted in a perfectly consistent and decent manner to all members of the CC community.

 

[fozy tornip]

Isn't that just typical?
You shag one sheep...

 

[theclaud]

Paley - you are correct in your assertions !

A bit of background information, by way of context.

About ten years ago, I did 3 or 4 CChat rides and theclaud was on everyone of them. We must have got on reasonably well, 'cos she gave me a hug goodbye after each one.

Some time after those rides, I decided to organise a CChat ride from my home. TC's name was one of the first on the list.

When TC arrived at my home, she was given a warm hug and a brew. On the ride itself, she smiled . . . a lot and I've the photos to show this !

When we stopped at a pub, the Hand Hotel in Llanarmon, I bought all my fellow riders a pint . . . including TC.

Essentially, I treated TC exactly the same as I did the rest of the (male) riders.

At the end of the ride, TC went off home with a hug and a large slice of (home-made) coffee cake.

These ^^^ are facts. This ^^^, is how TC was treated by me in 'real life'.

She is now seeking to have me labelled a misogynist, but the 'real-life' facts speak for themselves.




You've met me on at least half a dozen occasions, including at my own home.

You've seen my 'real-life' 'actual behaviour towards other members of the CC community' - and you know full well, that I've acted in a perfectly consistent and decent manner to all members of the CC community.

I've asked you to reflect on your participation in the online abuse of another person, subsequent to the rides you describe. So I don't know what the above is supposed to be background to, unless it's to remind everyone women can, if they choose, court and retain the approval of men by selling out other women. Which we already know.

 

[Unkraut]

Are you suggesting that as 'older woman', she was somehow entitled to special treatment and should have been allowed to 'get away' with such comments ? After ten years of putting up with comments that were spiteful and directed specifically at me (rather than the topic), I'd just had enough and responded in kind. She dished it out and didn't like it, when someone stood up to her.

I'm not sure it is necessarily good to reply in kind on occasions like this, however tempting, but why are you being accused of misogyny and she is not being accused of misandry? Seems to be a bit of double standard here. If the very definition of 'woman' is up for grabs these days, then there has to be a parallel uncertainty as to the meaning of 'misogyny' or even whether it still exists. It's people falling out with other people.

 

[mudsticks]

LOL. Well, Paley, the thing people need to grasp about structural issues like racism or misogyny is that structures left in place or reinforced will inevitably produce similar effects. So many people people may or may not remember or care if a couple of uppity women got bullied off and/or banned from a forum a few years back (or if a spin-off forum where people including those you wouldn't trust to be in charge of a hot cup of tea and those whose hard drives should probably be impounded were given moderating powers and the place took about a week to become a cess pit) but the same over-indulged resident reactionaries will react in the same way whenever they are challenged by a woman who stands her ground, answers back, displays expertise or confidence, or doesn't accord them the deference and respect they feel entitled to.

By uppity women I'm guessing ones who dare to have a contrary opinion at all, that isn't always couched about by ego soothing niceties.

It really doesn't take much to get labelled as uppity or 'spikey' on here, does it?

You're ok so long as you maintain an air of.

"Oh im just one of the guys really, not like one of those troublesome wimmin, over there"

'Pick me' schtick,

Step outside of that, and it all changes rather swiftly.