Oh no!! Brexit not going quite as well as hoped

Shouldn't we (ie Government) have a plan to rectify the bolded bit? We may well, of course, have to "import" labour/skills until we have closed the gap.

Yes. It's a consistent failure of most governments during my lifetime not to invest in it's people.
The cynic in me says that governments don't want educated people as they'll be unable to govern by lies and deceit.
To get where Sunak and Sunak-light (Starmer) want to be is a generational education and health change, it needs to start pre-birth.

Improved maternity care and maternity health
Decent nutrition from birth through education - bring back free school meals for all.
Invest in Teachers
Invest in parents
Invest in facilities for the less abled and the neurodiverse
Make sport/exercise an important part of the curriculum
Put Critical thinking and Life-Skills into the curriculum
Better interaction between local business and schools
Bring back the Polytechnic and invest in Technical schools

Maybe 2 generations....

Until then:
Do the best to use and train what you can get.
Fast-track asylum seekers to make them fit for work
Rejoin the EU
 

BoldonLad

Old man on a bike. Not a member of a clique.
Location
South Tyneside
Yes. It's a consistent failure of most governments during my lifetime not to invest in it's people.
The cynic in me says that governments don't want educated people as they'll be unable to govern by lies and deceit.
To get where Sunak and Sunak-light (Starmer) want to be is a generational education and health change, it needs to start pre-birth.

Improved maternity care and maternity health
Decent nutrition from birth through education - bring back free school meals for all.
Invest in Teachers
Invest in parents
Invest in facilities for the less abled and the neurodiverse
Make sport/exercise an important part of the curriculum
Put Critical thinking and Life-Skills into the curriculum
Better interaction between local business and schools
Bring back the Polytechnic and invest in Technical schools

Maybe 2 generations....

Until then:
Do the best to use and train what you can get.
Fast-track asylum seekers to make them fit for work
Rejoin the EU

Wouldn't disagree with much of that.

Not sure we ever had "free school meals for all", certainly do not remember it in my lifetime.

Would agree entirely that Education provision is a Government responsibility, however, wouldn't you say that employers have at least some responsibility when it comes to training for work skills?, so, for example, if Farmers need skilled agricultural workers, they should be investing in training them, just as (say) IT Companies should be investing in training skilled IT workers, and so on for various industries.

Given how technology progresses, we also need Re-training provision.
 
Wouldn't disagree with much of that.

Not sure we ever had "free school meals for all", certainly do not remember it in my lifetime.

Would agree entirely that Education provision is a Government responsibility, however, wouldn't you say that employers have at least some responsibility when it comes to training for work skills?, so, for example, if Farmers need skilled agricultural workers, they should be investing in training them, just as (say) IT Companies should be investing in training skilled IT workers, and so on for various industries.

Given how technology progresses, we also need Re-training provision.

We do, but we need to start with enough people with the basis of decent education, and decent health - and a large percentage population do not have that at age 16. I agree, we do need a far more 'diverse' education system to produce the essential people we need. We also need to engender aspiration and develop society to have different metrics than we have currently over how we value different kinds of work....
 

BoldonLad

Old man on a bike. Not a member of a clique.
Location
South Tyneside
We do, but we need to start with enough people with the basis of decent education, and decent health - and a large percentage population do not have that at age 16. I agree, we do need a far more 'diverse' education system to produce the essential people we need. We also need to engender aspiration and develop society to have different metrics than we have currently over how we value different kinds of work....

Agreed.

Daughter No2 is a Maths teacher in a County. Durham Comprehensive school. When I listen to her talk about the interest level of (some) pupils and, (some) parents, it does not fill me with confidence, sadly.
 
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mudsticks

mudsticks

Legendary Member
There was a landslip across the railway line, so the last part of our journey home was by taxi. German chef working during the 'off' season. I asked him why on earth he'd come here from Germany. He explained it had been fine before Brexit, but 'you idiots' had tanked the economy, broken the country. The trouble was, he said, that he'd been here so long that he had as much pensions savings here as back home. Lovely chap, we discussed the merits of various local eateries.

Any good recommendations I might not have come across.?

Wouldn't disagree with much of that.

Not sure we ever had "free school meals for all", certainly do not remember it in my lifetime.

Would agree entirely that Education provision is a Government responsibility, however, wouldn't you say that employers have at least some responsibility when it comes to training for work skills?, so, for example, if Farmers need skilled agricultural workers, they should be investing in training them, just as (say) IT Companies should be investing in training skilled IT workers, and so on for various industries.

Given how technology progresses, we also need Re-training provision.

Fwiw I do train people on my farm.
I don't get any help with the cost of that, but it's training on the job with meals accomodation and a stipend thrown in, in return for their help.

Many of them have gone on to find paid employment on similar farms..

Including on my own.
.
But this is an ad hoc arrangement set up by similarly minded farmers to fill the gap for training of this sort.

Government isn't offering any help with it.

We do, but we need to start with enough people with the basis of decent education, and decent health - and a large percentage population do not have that at age 16. I agree, we do need a far more 'diverse' education system to produce the essential people we need. We also need to engender aspiration and develop society to have different metrics than we have currently over how we value different kinds of work....


We still have a terrible (snobbish) attitude to manual, and service work in this country.
Care work, and all the essential trades and skills required by society.
And suggest that all our children should aspire to 'better than that'

Work such as mine has long been seen as only being fit for dullards - for people too 'stupid' to do white collar work.

Fwiw many of the people who come to train with me have university degrees in not necessarily related subjects.
Thankfully these intelligent people see the value of good nutritious food being grown in a less environmentally damaging way, and want to be part of that.

The education (and diet) of our young people in particular has been neglected for wayy too long

On school farms and growing areas feeding into those institutions themselves, and providing learning opportunities for the long term would be the ideal. Benefitting health and education outcomes in the long term

Trouble is all these are long term benefits
With our current fptp system it seems that any gov is highly disinclined to do anything that might not reap full rewards til 15 - 20 years down the line, just in case another administration might get the credit.

This is one of many reasons why we need PR - to get away from this binary 'winner takes all' system other civilised nations manage PR just fine.

And yes please let's rejoin.the EU asap -- If they'll have us 🙄
 

icowden

Über Member
Daughter No2 is a Maths teacher in a County. Durham Comprehensive school. When I listen to her talk about the interest level of (some) pupils and, (some) parents, it does not fill me with confidence, sadly.
Yup. Until we invest a *lot* more money in education we will continue to have a two tier education system. My older daughter isn't that keen on maths but she is lucky to be at a school where she can be in a class of 11 other girls all of whom have Dyslexia or other specific learning difficulties, has extra support available when needed and excellent teachers. As a result she was able to help her younger sister extrapolate and convert algebra to make X the subject of an equation whilst her parents were struggling a bit.

We need to learn from Finland where they invest hugely in education, have small class sizes and excellent resources.
 

Ian H

Über Member
Any good recommendations I might not have come across.?
The only one I hadn't been to that he recommended was Home Farm at Wilmington - excellent Thai food, apparently.
We agreed about the Pig at Gittisham - very disappointing, especially considering the splendid venue.

Fwiw I do train people on my farm.
I don't get any help with the cost of that, but it's training on the job with meals accommodation and a stipend thrown in, in return for their help.

Many of them have gone on to find paid employment on similar farms..

Including on my own.
.
But this is an ad hoc arrangement set up by similarly minded farmers to fill the gap for training of this sort.

Government isn't offering any help with it.

We still have a terrible (snobbish) attitude to manual, and service work in this country.
Care work, and all the essential trades and skills required by society.
And suggest that all our children should aspire to 'better than that'

Work such as mine has long been seen as only being fit for dullards - for people too 'stupid' to do white collar work.

Fwiw many of the people who come to train with me have university degrees in not necessarily related subjects.
Thankfully these intelligent people see the value of good nutritious food being grown in a less environmentally damaging way, and want to be part of that.

The education (and diet) of our young people in particular has been neglected for way too long

On school farms and growing areas feeding into those institutions themselves, and providing learning opportunities for the long term would be the ideal. Benefiting health and education outcomes in the long term

Trouble is all these are long term benefits
With our current fptp system it seems that any gov is highly disinclined to do anything that might not reap full rewards til 15 - 20 years down the line, just in case another administration might get the credit.

This is one of many reasons why we need PR - to get away from this binary 'winner takes all' system other civilised nations manage PR just fine.

And yes please let's rejoin.the EU asap -- If they'll have us 🙄
E (biology degree) didn't go into horticulture because of the low remuneration. She had a career in the Civil Service before retiring early, training for RHS qualifications and working at Kew. When she moved down here she started gardening for clients, but that was less interesting than she'd thought (she has a couple of elderly clients left, but they are gradually succumbing to old age). So now she's got an allotment which is producing more fruit & veg than we can eat. She also does some volunteer work gardening for a local charity.
My gardening career started and stopped many years ago - I looked after an Oxford millionaire's 11 acre estate back in the early 70s. It's still a hobby.
 
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mudsticks

mudsticks

Legendary Member
The only one I hadn't been to that he recommended was Home Farm at Wilmington - excellent Thai food, apparently.
We agreed about the Pig at Gittisham - very disappointing, especially considering the splendid venue.


E (biology degree) didn't go into horticulture because of the low remuneration. She had a career in the Civil Service before retiring early, training for RHS qualifications and working at Kew. When she moved down here she started gardening for clients, but that was less interesting than she'd thought (she has a couple of elderly clients left, but they are gradually succumbing to old age). So now she's got an allotment which is producing more fruit & veg than we can eat. She also does some volunteer work gardening for a local charity.
My gardening career started and stopped many years ago - I looked after an Oxford millionaire's 11 acre estate back in the early 70s. It's still a hobby.

Nope the remuneration isn't the greatest - other things have to compensate - but at least no shortage of fresh air, exercise, and in my case fresh food too.
I manage to make a living - others do struggle - but that's the undervalued food production, and all those externalised costs not factored in.

Agree about the Pig at Coombe - i enjoyed eating there earlier this year - but then someone else was footing the bill :angel:
Many many (many) years ago when it was under previous, slightly more eccentric ownership i did a stint waitressing there - i think the portions were larger back in those days .

Not heard of Home Farm :okay: might be worth a drop in on the way back from somewhere..
 
Russia, sanctioned by much of the world vs UK sanctioned by itself.

BAB77B5F-B5FD-417E-9EF1-2ABD1EB408D6.jpeg


The UK’s economy is set to be the worst performer in the G20 bar Russia over the next two years, the OECD said on Tuesday as it warned that countries must continue to make fighting inflation their top priority.

https://www.ft.com/content/d6b84faf-f556-4fdd-ac27-65c2d514aa2f
 
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