Climate Crisis: Are we doing enough?

[BoldonLad]

The energy you put in is used to pump heat from a source (the air or the ground) into your house. So you can easily pump a whole load more heat than the energy you used to do the pumping, and hence get an "efficiency " of >100%.

I wasn't familiar with the current figures so thanks @mjr .

Ok. Still sounds like a “free meal”, but, I shall read up on it.

 

[matticus]

I *guess* it's like extracting coal: the energy used to carry it to the surface is a lot less than released from burning it.
A slightly odd use of "efficiency", but not actually wrong.

 

[mudsticks]

Annoyingly, the typical efficiency of air-to-water heat pumps at 350% and gas boilers at 92% means that AS heat pumps work out at 8p/kWh of heat while gas boilers work out at 7.8p/kWh... so it's still cheaper to burn gas. Way to tackle the climate crisis, folks(!)

At least we moved from oil, which is not only completely horrible for emissions but also slightly more expensive than gas, so it works out about the same price as because the boiler needed replacing either way.

But "about the same price" is not going to meet any climate crisis targets. Rishi and friends have dropped the ball and it's probably at least another six months wasted, if not a year if the pricing structure isn't changed for October.

Thankfully the relative price of ASHP is coming down .

If you're contemplating a new build then it makes total sense to go down that route, in fact building control (and planners) favour it. .


But when it comes to retrofitting existing properties , it's going to need a fiscal shunt from government.

 

[Milkfloat]

Thankfully the relative price of ASHP is coming down .

If you're contemplating a new build then it makes total sense to go down that route, in fact building control (and planners) favour it. .


But when it comes to retrofitting existing properties , it's going to need a fiscal shunt from government.

The government have had many chances to force ASHP for new builds, but keep kicking the can down the road as the house builders kept lobbying against it. The government should have got firmer on this years ago and also offered incentives to those on oil or not on the gas main, then lastly for replacement mains gas boilers.

 

[mudsticks]

The government have had many chances to force ASHP for new builds, but keep kicking the can down the road as the house builders kept lobbying against it. The government should have got firmer on this years ago and also offered incentives to those on oil or not on the gas main, then lastly for replacement mains gas boilers.

Indeed they 'should' have done all these things .

But as per it's left up to us sandal wearing eco froot loops to hurry things up ..

Currently trying to decide btxt ASHP or ground source ..Probs will go with air source as it requires less trenching.

 

[Milkfloat]

Indeed they 'should' have done all these things .

But as per it's left up to us sandal wearing eco froot loops to hurry things up ..

Currently trying to decide btxt ASHP or ground source ..Probs will go with air source as it requires less trenching.

IIRC ground source is far more efficient. If only you knew someone with a tractor and land.

 

[mudsticks]

IIRC ground source is far more efficient. If only you knew someone with a tractor and land.

Well that's just it..

Got the land, and the digger driving skills.

Will have to cost it up..

Tbh the house itself will probs be so well insulated that a heat pump may not get that much use.anyhow

Esp as there'll be a solar array, and woodburner using home grown timber.

We'll see.

 

[mjr]

The government should have got firmer on this years ago and also offered incentives to those on oil or not on the gas main, then lastly for replacement mains gas boilers.

I'd settle for them moving some of the climate change taxes onto gas and oil. It seems bonkers that renewable and nuclear electricity still pay over double that of fossil fuels since their exemptions were removed in 2015, quite aside from my personal interest.

 

[Ian H]

Thankfully the relative price of ASHP is coming down .

If you're contemplating a new build then it makes total sense to go down that route, in fact building control (and planners) favour it. .


But when it comes to retrofitting existing properties , it's going to need a fiscal shunt from government.

This largish, draughty, Victorian house would be very difficult to bring up to any kind of insulation spec sufficient for air-source to heat it. It came with an AGA, which ain't the most eco-friendly lump of iron. We've done quite a lot: new boiler, zoned heating, double-glazing, new roof with extra insulation. But still...

 

[mjr]

Ok. Still sounds like a “free meal”, but, I shall read up on it.

It is astonishing, plus you can go sit by the outdoor unit on a hot afternoon and press the "heat the water tank now" button for a blast of cool air while still being fairly eco (because you'd want that hot water at some point anyway: solar thermal is better on sunny days but we've not got that yet).

Other astonishing things are that large warm radiators keep things warm better than small hot ones and how much energy is saved trying to predict how fast the house is cooling (weather compensation or auto adaptation or setback, depending on manufacturer and country) instead of only reacting after it gets cold like most burner-boiler systems.

Less astonishing is the number of cockups being made by heating installers inexperienced with them, from what I can see online.

 

[mudsticks]

This largish, draughty, Victorian house would be very difficult to bring up to any kind of insulation spec sufficient for air-source to heat it. It came with an AGA, which ain't the most eco-friendly lump of iron. We've done quite a lot: new boiler, zoned heating, double-glazing, new roof with extra insulation. But still...

Yes old houses can be nice to look at , but often very poorly designed for how we need to live now.

And can be hard to adapt

I feel like I've done my rental time in damp cob cottages, draughty brick farmhouses, freezing servants annexes, and poorly insulated trailers.

Time for something altogether more comfortable, and economical .

 

[mjr]

Yes old houses can be nice to look at , but often very poorly designed for how we need to live now.

And can be hard to adapt

Even new houses can be very poorly designed, but at least they are usually easier to adapt.

And we probably do need to adapt as much as can be, to avoid all the costs (money and climate) of demolition and rebuilding.

 

[icowden]

Everyone enjoying climate change today? 40.2 C at Heathrow...

 

[winjim]

Everyone enjoying climate change today? 40.2 C at Heathrow...

That's nothing. In 1976 my parents were working at Heathrow.

 

[AuroraSaab]

To be fair, if it wasn't for climate change we wouldn't have headlines like this, so swings and roundabouts really: